The Shouty Woman

December 19, 2006

Final proof that a certain well-known blog has become a hate site:

Filed under: Feminism — by Lucy @ 2:37 pm

  Warning – may be upsetting.

  • “I’d like to take a piss in a public can knowing for a fact there are no boys in there whining “I was born in the wrong body” for fucksake, insisting I refer to him as “she.” Phobic? Hardly. Resentful that women lose yet another space of their own? You betcha big time.”
  • “Why is it every time women tell men to get their foot off our necks, men cry we’re manhaters and claim they’re being oppressed? “Transphobia” is the new version of this very old game. Same shit, different label. “
  • “Well if men can now use the women’s bathroom, wouldn’t that make the women’s bathroom just as dangerous as the men’s? Or do trans boys imagine they’d be the only man allowed in there? Ooops, sorry. Didn’t mean to use logic. And ruin that trans boy harem fantasy they have going on in their heads.”
  • “Oh, I have no problem with trans using the right bathroom. The one with the sign that says “men” on it.”
  • “Now let’s cut through your load of bull. Ask yourself one question. Who benefits? Women? Do women benefit when men use their bathroom? Do women benefit when men pass themselves off as women?”
  • “So, do I get to be whatever race I choose? Do I get to be an woman of colour or a black woman because I *really* feel like one (even though I’m white as the freshly driven snow)?”
  • “Sex is static. It cannot be changed. Men cannot be frogs, they cannot be giraffes, they cannot be trees, they cannot be rocks, and they cannot be women. Get over it.”
  • “Just for the record, I do not fear or hate these psychologically damaged boys. I pity them. I do hate that “professionals” can say they are able to magically turn these pitiful guys in a woman. As I said before, they should lose their license to practice medicine by praying on and profiting off the mental problems of these unfortunates.”

These examples are from one single thread, which didn’t even start out as being about trans issues. It’s like they can’t stop themselves from spilling out this bile and hatred. How can they think this is an acceptable way to talk about their fellow human beings?

I can’t believe I ever associated myself with these people, however peripherally.

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46 Comments »

  1. speaking of “warning, may be upsetting – ”

    check out

    http://phonelesscord.wordpress.com/2006/12/19/thoughts-on-the-peoples-prostitutes/

    or

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/columnists/columnists.html?in_article_id=423549&in_page_id=1772&in_author_id=322

    but only click on that last link if you are prepared to throw up in your mouth a little bit. it’s that bad.

    Comment by phonelesscord — December 19, 2006 @ 4:20 pm |Reply

  2. His name is descriptive, however. Richard Littlejohn, DICK LITTLEJOHN….

    Comment by Andrea — December 19, 2006 @ 10:38 pm |Reply

  3. Lucy, can you tell me which blog that is from? You could comment over on mine if you like, and I won’t publish the comment…

    Comment by Andrea — December 19, 2006 @ 10:39 pm |Reply

  4. Nevermind, I found it myself.

    Agreed, hate site.

    Comment by Andrea — December 19, 2006 @ 10:51 pm |Reply

  5. yeah, three guesses, right? I hope she’s proud of herself.

    oh, and of course it’s immediately obvious that those quotes are supposed to be from feminists, as opposed to say rabid rightwingers.

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 12:17 am |Reply

  6. oh jesus, that Daily Mail quote…

    and yes, isn’t that the very same rag which Our Heroine was quoting from approvingly not long ago? I’m just surprised she’s not giving her nod to this one as well. wonder how many of the lemmings would try to find a way to rationalize it as feminism if she said it was.

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 12:23 am |Reply

  7. strangely – I had not conceived it in those terms.

    quite something to think about.

    Comment by antiprincess — December 20, 2006 @ 3:34 am |Reply

  8. Yeah … I’ve been following this thread.
    Frankly, I just don’t get it.
    I would expect far more tollerance among that community and in so many areas there just is none.

    Comment by Kim — December 20, 2006 @ 8:15 am |Reply

  9. Can you imagine saying those kind of things about any other minority?

    Comment by Winter — December 20, 2006 @ 8:58 am |Reply

  10. Winter – exactly. They can’t seem to understand that this is as offensive as racism, homophobia or any other irrational prejudice.

    Comment by Lucy — December 20, 2006 @ 9:56 am |Reply

  11. Phonelesscord – thanks for the links. Richard Littlejohn is a vile excuse for a human being who uses his newspaper column as an outlet for his hatred. I avoid reading him as I value my sanity.

    Comment by Lucy — December 20, 2006 @ 9:59 am |Reply

  12. Well, there -was- that business where pony was saying someone “sounds like a fag”…

    and, i dunno: while i haven’t seen any of them using similar racial slurs, a lot of them seem pretty at home with rather shockingly casual racism and classism.

    for that matter, as i’ve said, i don’t really see the difference between “sexbot” and “bimbo,” and TF actually uses the word “slut” (but you know it’s DIFFERENT)

    and there was the time where TF referred to Dawn Eden as “zipper-cunt” (in the process of expressing bewilderment that anyone might liken her, Twisty, to that other person. Which, she might be right at that: Dawn Eden is a paleolithic religious reactionary with a pantheon of thoroughly awful regular commenters, and dumb as toast; still, i don’t recall her being as purely nasty as TF. then again admittedly i don’t read her regularly).

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 11:25 am |Reply

  13. one could i suppose make an argument that anti-male sexism is rather rampant there as well, even though it gets into the dreaded What About Teh Menz? territory (heaven forfend).

    still, while it may not have the same structural weight of institutionalized oppression behind it, i can’t help but think that calling it “hate” in a number of cases is fair. (not TF, please note, as Chris Clarke once noted one could argue just as easily that she “loves” men; can’t say i see it wrt women, and then “love” may be a bit strong as it is not something i’m entirely convinced the woman is capable of)

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 11:32 am |Reply

  14. for that matter, a number of them seem to devolve into good ol’ fashioned straightforward misogynistic slurs pretty easily; well, g-m-r is a case unto herself admittedly; still, that time where she was not only flinging around “bitch” and “cunt” like they were going out of style (at women too, yes) but telling some woman “you’re that professional virgin who had her hymen embalmed. you have nothing to say”–that was, well, rather -special.-

    she’s never ever acknowledged that there might be a teensy problem with this either, even when called on it months later (or anything else she’s ever said or done; but that’s our gin, Flying Spaghetti Monster love her). worse imo are the supposedly sane women who enable her in this behavior, on account of y’know she’s such a stellar, caring feminist.

    oh and i first got to know BB when she called me and a couple of other women “shrieking harpies.” admittedly i -was- trolling (can’t say so much for the other two), but y’know i’d come specifically and only thus far to flame her boyfriend (the Radical Feminist Boyfriend, the one who’d annoyed the crap out of me with his smug ignorant proclamations not only on all of BDSM but specifically on “homosexual” BDSM, y’know, it’s -patriarchal-). Stand By Your Man!

    and, as noted, there is all the slut-baiting and femme-bashing…

    yes, they’re just too “advanced” for the likes of me, in their feminism, i reckon. that must be the problem.

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 11:47 am |Reply

  15. I have to say I still read and link to gin’s site – I disagree with her a lot of the time but she writes well, and for some reason she doesn’t get to me like TF does. I also think BB is OK, but agree about the boyfriend.

    BB’s been very quiet lately actually – hope she’s alright.

    Comment by Lucy — December 20, 2006 @ 12:18 pm |Reply

  16. as Chris Clarke once noted one could argue just as easily that she “loves” men

    lightly breaded and deep fried, maybe…

    Comment by antiprincess — December 20, 2006 @ 1:43 pm |Reply

  17. Heh.

    Comment by Lucy — December 20, 2006 @ 1:52 pm |Reply

  18. Wow. Wow. Wow.

    Wow.

    Sorry, I just… I have no other words right now.

    It’s always scary – yet enlightening – when the mask comes off, isn’t it?

    If I didn’t know better I’d have thought these quotes came from Townhall.com or somesuch place. Or Daily Mail!

    Comment by Amber — December 20, 2006 @ 6:47 pm |Reply

  19. Oh and to this commenter especially:

    Just for the record, I do not fear or hate these psychologically damaged boys. I pity them. I do hate that “professionals” can say they are able to magically turn these pitiful guys in a woman. As I said before, they should lose their license to practice medicine by praying on and profiting off the mental problems of these unfortunates.”

    You fucking pathetic assbag. That shit sounds like it could be coming from any evangelical preacher in the US, talking about the ho-mo-sexshuls and how he doesn’t FEAR them, he wants to HELP them. Blah blah babbidty blah.

    Look, I don’t like to bring my own shit into these discussions, bc I worry it’ll make me look like I’m trying to say, “Look how much better I am than xyz” or something, BUT… this time I just want to say. My ex-husband and I divorced bc of his (now her!) gender dysphoria. So my ex is a MtF transsexual. Also I run a support site for partners (current and former) of transfolk. Dealing witha ll of that was the hardest thing I ever did in my life. I literally felt, for months, that I would die. I didn’t know how to function every morning when somehow, I kept waking up alive. By all calculations I should hate all transpeople, right? Except… I dont’.

    So if *I* don’t, then I don’t understnad what makes some of these so-called “feminists” tick with their hate.

    Comment by Amber — December 20, 2006 @ 6:51 pm |Reply

  20. Oh and I also saw THIS gem…

    In response to the question: “How the hell does a transwoman using the women’s bathroom hurt you?”

    Came the answer:

    Because any piece of shit pervert can now claim he’s a woman and enter a woman’s bathroom. What’s the harm in that? Let me count the ways.

    —-

    Fuck. Me.

    Seriously? (I know that is a blog cliche, but it fits here, so I’m saying it!) WTF. Who in the hell is going to do that?? That’s like saying gay marriage threatens the sanctity of marriage bc now straight folks will run out and marry someone of the same sex, just because they can.

    Tell me, please, in what Bizzaro World is this happening.

    Comment by Amber — December 20, 2006 @ 7:03 pm |Reply

  21. I can understand why people would like g-m-r, depending on their experience of her. Let’s just say my own experience is a bit different, and leave it at that.

    Amber: three guesses.

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 7:58 pm |Reply

  22. and yeah, i’ve pretty much let BB be at this point. i do have a special place in my heart for radical feminist menz. particularly since primarily what we were trying to explain in our blunt ways were that the first tenet of feminism as -we- understood it wrt mens was, if yer in a feminist space and women are talking about their own experience, -even if it ends up supporting a position you don’t agree with,- the -feminist- thing to do, o Radical Feminist Man, is sit your ass down, shut up, and -listen.- Not counter, not lecture, not talk out of your ass…

    the hetcentricism gets to me as well; and well, lookie here where it all leads.

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 8:02 pm |Reply

  23. so, which one made the womens’ bathroom pervert remark? luckynkl? Mar Iguana (the genius who said something like she didn’t give a damn about racism)? saltyC?

    personally i still think that the woman who was lecturing a woman with stage IV cancer about how she’s just bitter because no one’s holding a fundraiser for her and should really be a “better role model for suffering” wins the prize; but admittedly it’s some stiff competition.

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 8:06 pm |Reply

  24. and of course, the ZOMG MEN IN THE WOMENS’ BATHROOM was one of the arguments against feminism the Phyllis Housefly types used to ‘argue” with, back in the day. you know, as in this is where it all leads. that, and ZOMG LEZZZBIANZ of course.

    but they’re all POLITICAL LESBIANS in there, of course, or at least NOT AT ALL HOMOPHOBIC, NOOOOOO.

    just as long as you never have to have any icky objetifying degrading SEX with OTHER WOMEN, please note.

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 8:09 pm |Reply

  25. btw, thought some people might appreciate this:

    http://www.operationdoubles.com/narc/index.htm

    “Another thing narcissists do is try to control their Pathological Space, the network of relationships in their home, extended families, workplace, and neighborhood. They need to control what word gets around. In addition, controlling people is desirable in itself for a narcissist. It “proves” his delusion that he is a god. Since childhood, narcissists have constantly gained experience manipulating people. As adults they are expert manipulators and often can control whole groups.

    …The narcissist makes them his minions, his remote-control mouths, his worshipers. Because they all fear him (though none will admit that). They say and think whatever he wants and do his bidding. This is what, in the workplace for example, enables him to get away with murder: it’s just the victim’s word against everybody else’s.

    In fact, manipulating a group of people is easier than manipulating one person. For, human society is like a hive of social insects. Buzz, buzz, buzz till suddenly the gang instinct kicks in and it’s unanimous. Zoom, they swarm! Somebody becomes a social outcast. It’s the proverbial fate worse than death. So nobody wants to be caught dead near anybody the evil eye is on. Parents betray their children. Brothers betray sisters.

    See also Bystanders, observers, and witnesses – Why won’t they help the victim?

    Because people are like this, cynics can exploit and manipulate them like puppets. En-masse even. A sad fact but true. It’s dangerous to go through life with the misconception that most people are good. While we can, and should, give every individual the benefit of the doubt, we should face the fact that the great majority of people just go along with the herd. No matter what it’s doing! So, it doesn’t pay to be too trusting of people who haven’t earned our trust. (Con artists get rich on misplaced trust.)

    Because most people’s behavior conforms to whatever wins them approval, acceptance, and inclusion in the surrounding herd, a cynic can use this power over them to make them build him a pyramid or to march them off to war. But he puts it to most effective use when he uses it to sic them like a pack of hounds on some person or group. That demonstrates his absolute power over them and makes an example of what happens to anybody he sicks them on, establishing for him a reign of terror. In a nation, a workplace, a neighborhood, or a family. It happens in any closed environment. If you introduce a narcissistic bully to orchestrate it, you get a bloodbath every single time. “

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 8:23 pm |Reply

  26. Well, damn. I had to go look it up.

    Is it just me, or are they getting weirder? I mean, at first it was just “Calling someone a slut is FEMINIST!”

    But, now? They’ve hit, “Homosexuality is a CHOICE!” “Every girl deserves a feminine name and to be treated like a GIRL!” And, “Transsexuals are a bunch of SICKOS!” I mean… what’s next? “Birth control DEMEANS a woman’s NATURAL FERTILITY!” “Abortion is a weapon used against the UTERUS that MAKES YOU A WOMAN!”

    ‘Cause, seriously, they’re only a stone’s throw from that kind of shit these days.

    Comment by Veronica — December 20, 2006 @ 9:32 pm |Reply

  27. It wouldn’t surprise me. there was already someone writing about how much more EMPOWERING giving birth is than whatever else is on the shitlist these days.

    mind you i don’t know how well that’s going to sit with the anti-“breeder” brigade…

    and yes, they would appear to be steadily growing weirder. i mean, some kind of award for the pre-emptive castration thread, seriously. it doesn’t surprise me–that kind of closer loop can’t do otherwise–but i do wish the other people that i like and respect who still think she’s the bee’s knees (mostly men at this point, oddly enough) would figure it out for themselves; i can only say it so many times in so many ways and places before sounding like a Compleat Krank.

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 10:09 pm |Reply

  28. I think some folks think we’re each other’s sockpuppets, BD.

    teehee. my little lambchop.

    Comment by antiprincess — December 20, 2006 @ 10:47 pm |Reply

  29. That’s so cute. I wonder if Bea/Feminist First/Pippi/Phemisaurus is among those so speculating.

    yeah; that pic of both of us with bimbo and Robin in NY was clearly done with mirrors.

    and of course it couldn’t simply be that a number of different people come to similar conclusions independently (i.e. U R an EEjit), and further are now friends with each other and hence pick up on each others’ phrases and ideas; no, we must be the SAME PERSON.

    it’s pretty creative, of whoever it is that’s the Real Person, you have to admit; making up all those different bios, significant other in your case, living situations and locations, and so on…

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 11:24 pm |Reply

  30. anyway i thought i was already BL’s sockpuppet. now i’m your sockpuppet too? i’m such a sockpuppet slut. everyone’s hand up my ass…(but in a completely non-patriarchal, non-oppressive way, of course).

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 11:25 pm |Reply

  31. …duh, it took me till just now to get “lamb chop.” HA ha…

    Comment by belledame222 — December 20, 2006 @ 11:44 pm |Reply

  32. creative and exhausting. who has time?

    Comment by antiprincess — December 21, 2006 @ 12:06 am |Reply

  33. Is phemisaurus the same person as Bea etc? I didn’t know that.

    Comment by Lucy — December 21, 2006 @ 10:37 am |Reply

  34. Yeah, and she’s blogging under a new title of ‘Dead Men Don’t Rape’
    😦

    Comment by Laura — December 21, 2006 @ 1:48 pm |Reply

  35. ‘Dead Men Don’t Rape’??

    Is she suggesting we kill them all?

    Jesus.

    Comment by Lucy — December 21, 2006 @ 6:05 pm |Reply

  36. Hey, at least it’d be a bit more entertaining. Castration, rape…good times!

    i mean, for some of ’em it’s just the logical end to the way they’ve been thinking already.

    i will look out for Bea’s name on the evening news. do they have bell towers in her part of England?

    Comment by belledame222 — December 21, 2006 @ 6:10 pm |Reply

  37. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

    Comment by Amber — December 21, 2006 @ 6:18 pm |Reply

  38. Makes me so sick. Ugh.

    Comment by Burrow — December 21, 2006 @ 11:56 pm |Reply

  39. […] So several people whom I appreciate a great deal have written about this post–or, rather, the development of its comments thread. They’ve already dealt with the categorization of some comments as hate speech, and the ways in which they are hateful, and I’m tired–so I’ll simply link their incisive analyses. […]

    Pingback by Feministe » Okay. — December 28, 2006 @ 5:07 pm |Reply

  40. […] highlights from some especially nasty comments go, the bigotry got pretty ugly (hat tip to Lucy at Shouty Woman for saving these tidbits; I’ve added the originators of the comments to indict the […]

    Pingback by The SmackDog Chronicles » Blog Archive » Queer Dewd Layeth The Bitchslap Down For Sex-Positive Feminism — January 3, 2007 @ 6:21 am |Reply

  41. Survivalace, I don’t understand your comment. You liked the post, but I’m an evil feminazi? And what ‘followers’? Last time I checked it was just me here.

    Comment by Lucy — January 3, 2007 @ 1:26 pm |Reply

  42. I don’t think survivalace read anything here. I think he just found the word feminist and felt compelled to post. Pretty funny in a pitiful way.

    Comment by Thirza — January 3, 2007 @ 5:24 pm |Reply

  43. survivalace links to a spam blog. You might want to delete the comment.

    Comment by Amber — January 3, 2007 @ 8:40 pm |Reply

  44. Thanks Amber – done.

    Comment by Lucy — January 3, 2007 @ 9:53 pm |Reply

  45. I’m also curious what blog this original post came from…

    But more to the point, I’m wondering if you have an opinion about the blogstorm over Full Frontal Feminism – I pretty much missed the whole thing and am trying to piece it all together after the fact. Seems like the whole thing got pretty vitriolic though. Do you have a take of all of that?

    Comment by phonelesscord — May 30, 2007 @ 9:26 pm |Reply

  46. Phonelesscord – it came from I Blame The Patriarchy, back in December.

    Wrt Full Frontal Feminism, I’ve made a deliberate choice to stay out of that particular fight as I haven’t read the book. As I understand it some people were upset that Jessica only dealt with feminism from a white middle-class viewpoint. They may well be right, but I don’t want to comment until I’ve read the book. Also, as you say, I think it got pretty vitriolic, and I’m trying to steer clear of feminist blogwars right now.

    Comment by Lucy — May 30, 2007 @ 9:32 pm |Reply


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